Anti-feminist mailbag (the missing 5% edition)

dunce.gifWe receive a lot of hate email here at Feministing, and this one was too good not to share.

Men are better than women look at the comparison in IQ men are scientifically proven to have a higher IQ by roughly 5 points, or 5% you cannot dispute science sorry and if you want a much better website than your shitty one you might want to go to [redacted]. I think you would gain a lot more knowledge from that website and you might learn about the truth that way you would not be so stupid and ignorant you stupid cunts.

Apparently that extra five percent doesn’t help prevent run-on sentences. You would also think that those extra brain power percentage points would stop a dude from sending harassing emails from his school email address. Because then we wouldn’t know that our charming admirer is the public relations officer (yes, public relations) of the Southern Illinois University College Republicans, Alex Kochno. I think I’ll stick with my stupid cunt lady brain, thanks very much.

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  1. pixelgem
    Posted April 18, 2008 at 5:49 pm | Permalink

    Actually, pixelgem, I do not think that officer list is entirely accurate as of now. We have a female fundraiser and last year we had a female president.
    Cool! ;o)

  2. elena
    Posted April 18, 2008 at 7:32 pm | Permalink

    “I like the idea of a film screening, especially on a feminist topic. [...] I will bring it up Wednesday at our meeting.”
    Thank you, that sounds great! :)

  3. San
    Posted April 18, 2008 at 10:49 pm | Permalink

    Kudos to Haubrich! Coming on this site and being straightforward about the situation was brave and amazing. Maybe Kochno should follow you around and learn how to be a decent human being.
    And I have to say I feel sorry for Alex Kochno. As an employer I usually google every prospective employee. And when I google him now this page is the first link.
    So Alex, that one little “drunken” moment may screw you for good. I know I wouldn’t hire you based on a question of character alone. Now is the time to start trying to reverse that karma. I wholeheartedly wish you the best of luck in that.
    To all my fellow women: Don’t hate the haters, it only tears you up.

  4. Posted April 19, 2008 at 3:21 am | Permalink

    The school is actually SIU-Carbondale. Please, please, please let me report him!!!! I’ve always wanted to get a douchebag misogynist kicked out of school.

  5. Plex Flexico
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 3:35 am | Permalink

    I know I’m a little late, but I really wanted to get something off my chest:
    Alex: Your apology is worth nothing to me. It was most certainly not sincere, as you were not only forced to make an apology, you also chose to try to use your “apology” to make lame excuses for your behavior.
    I hope your mother, grandmother, aunts, sisters, cousins, friends, acquaintances, potential employers and every woman you might ever come into contact with sees the idiotic and hate filled crap you chose to spew on a lovely spring morning.
    I hope, for your sake, that you are never again employed by any institution or business where you would have the opportunity to have contact with the public, in person or otherwise. Judging by the remarks of your colleague, you would be better suited to a life of solitude, away from others, perhaps studying how to improve public relations with the rocks in the heart of the Gobi Desert.
    Now, instead of apologizing to just the ladies here, why don’t you “man up” and apologize to the entire human race for your willful ignorance and your utter lack of basic social skills.
    You are a disgrace, and it’s even more disgraceful that the institution that employed you was well aware of the types of attitudes you hold and remarks you make in public. You superiors who have excused or allowed your behavior in the past should be called upon to explain their actions, or lack of action, to the public and either prove they will no longer allow this sort of disgusting behavior or resign.

  6. Posted April 19, 2008 at 4:07 am | Permalink

    Ok, I need to read comments before I comment myself (silly me). They would’ve kicked anyone who did this out of school where I went to school, though!

  7. Laurel
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 8:22 am | Permalink

    It’s on BoingBoing today.
    And that means our Alex is pretty much immortal now.

  8. Posted April 19, 2008 at 10:14 am | Permalink

    I was President of the College Democrats when I went to SIUC and years later it still makes me happy to see a College Republican get what’s coming to him. The other sad part is that after hours of listening to talk radio this is probably what he thinks all intelligent debate consists of.

  9. bernarda
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 11:03 am | Permalink

    All males are listed at the College Repub site, and they are organizing a bake sale!
    I mean, how gay is that?

  10. pointy bird
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 12:30 pm | Permalink

    “I mean, how gay is that?”
    Wow. Totally unnecessary. Way to sap all the “righteous” out of “righteous indignation.”

  11. Tom
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 12:42 pm | Permalink

    Wow, just catching up with this firestorm. It’s fantastic that Alex is feeling the heat from this. For those who were concerned that this *might* cause Alex to react more negatively to women, remember one thing that’s absolutely certain — lack of consequences for unacceptable behavior is guaranteed to reinforce that behavior.
    Maybe now he’ll think twice before doing something like this. And even if his views don’t change, at least he’ll spread less of this vileness because he’ll know that the people around him won’t stand for it.
    And for DaveNJ and Jacqueline, it doesn’t matter what the scale for an IQ test (or any test) is when discussing the difference between two populations — if the average IQ score is 100, 5 points higher is a 5% increase. And the test is designed such that 100 is supposed to be the median. Apparently, about half the population falls into the 90 to 109 range, and the average (mean) is roughly 100.

  12. LynstHolin
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 12:54 pm | Permalink

    I am deeply sorry about that now could you please accept that.
    -Alex Kochno

    Whenever I’m working and I catch a kid shoplifting, the first thing the kid says is, “I’m sorry.”
    My response: “You’re not sorry you did it, you’re sorry you got caught.”

  13. Mairead
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 1:33 pm | Permalink

    I am an older feminist (67.5) and would ask that younger feminists using the term “douchebag” as a pejorative think about the meaning of the term and why and by whom it might be considered insulting. We certainly wouldn’t use “soap” or “washcloth” as an insult, would we?
    Just a thought.
    (I, too, congratulate Wess Haubrich and Jermaine Raymer for their prompt, professional responses to the situation begun by Alex Kochno.
    And I second the suggestion to Alex that he consider finding a professional with whom he can feel comfortable discussing the feelings he has about people who aren’t like him.
    Those feelings will hinder your life in countless ways, Alex. Hiring managers, of which I was one, routinely reject even the best-qualified people if they have attitudes that will cause problems on the job. And if their problem doesn’t appear til after they’re hired, the usual remedy is a squeezeout with a lukewarm reference. Be told. )

  14. Raymer
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 3:01 pm | Permalink

    First, I would like to iterate what Haubrich said, and confirm that we do have a woman who serves as our Fund Raising Chair. I would also like to point out that the cabinet of an organization can only reflect the applicants for it.
    And for those of you that have taken the time to email or facebook myself individually, I want you to know that I am reading every single message and will reply to each individually.
    We are also taking down all suggestions that have been made on this board and through the individual communications in an attempt to best decide how this breech of decorum should and will be handled.

  15. Posted April 19, 2008 at 3:46 pm | Permalink

    bernarda – your “gay” comment is hateful and totally inappropriate. In fact, it sounds like something Alex Kochno would say.
    Mairead – “douchebag” is actually a pretty appropriate insult, since douches are useless and unnecessary tools to make women feel like their natural selves aren’t good enough. I think it is a lot different than soap or a washcloth, personally, and will continue to use it as an insult.

  16. Nick
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 5:34 pm | Permalink

    You are absolutely right I thought of that after the post basically everybody that is offended by my remarks I am deeply sorry about that now could you please accept that.
    -Alex Kochno
    That doesn’t sound like a sincere apology.
    Your remarks were stunningly hateful; it looks like you really hate women. I don’t think a person can unwind that kind of hate with a day or two of contrition.
    As a fellow alcoholic, I know something about blackouts and behavior during blackouts. Some people get hostile when drunk. I’m not sure whether that is simply because the booze unlocks their hidden character or whether we all have that sort of ugliness inside us.
    But if you truly did do this while in a blackout, then the odds are you’re a drunk. This sort of behavior will recur unless you put down the bottle and enter onto a path of recovery.
    That’ll be the real amends that will demonstrate sincere regret over your remarks.

  17. Rosie G
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 6:50 pm | Permalink

    Yes, as another poster mentioned, it’s on BoingBoing today. Whee! Alex, I sure hope that you’re pleased with yourself. Your “little indiscretion” is going to come back to bite you again and again. Have fun with all that email, I’m sure your employer and university will just relish every message. Ciao!

  18. meeneecat
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 8:25 pm | Permalink

    I’m a little late to this as well, but first thing I wanted to say thank you to Haubrich and the other members of your group for handling this so promptly and professionally. I accept your words on about how what Alex said does not represent the rest of the members of your group, and the way you handled this situation, maturely and respectfully, shows me exactly that.
    Alex, I am hurt and angry about what you said. VERY ANGRY. But instead of expressing to you all my rage, I am going to try and help you make the most of this situation by offering some advice.
    First of all I think you obviously don’t know many feminist women or have an understanding of what feminism is all about. But, just try and imagine what it’s like walking in someone else’s shoes and to be judged for your gender, the color of your skin, your religion, or any other characteristic that doesn’t fit into society’s established norm. Many many people will tell you: it really sucks. First, you need to start by examining your own “privilege” and also learning about the concept of “privilege” (i.e. male privilege, white privilege, Christian privilege etc.) and how it colors the way you see the world. (note: this is a very hard thing to do and is always uncomfortable, but, if it’s NOT uncomfortable, than you’re doing it wrong)
    Now, I know it’s hard to imagine what it’s like to be someone else that’s different from you and it’s most definitely hard to examine the issue of privilege, but there’s steps that you can take that will help and at least be a step in the right direction.
    I suggest:
    1. Taking some women’s studies courses and/or a course on racism and/or different religions.
    2. Visit feminist blogs/sites and read about feminist theory (feminism 101) FYI: there’s also a blogroll to the left on this website).
    3. Watch some feminist films & movies/movies directed by women that feature female leads.
    4. Attend a meeting by one of your school’s feminist groups. Or even hold a joint meeting with your group and theirs.
    *5. MOST IMPORTANTLY: Listen. Listening is THE MOST important thing you can do if you are to learn.
    I’m sure we’d all be interested in learning how this progresses and what Alex, you learn (if anything) over the next couple weeks/months. Who knows maybe you’ll even call yourself a “feminist ally” in short time…but, we won’t hold our collective breath. Good luck.

  19. Posted April 19, 2008 at 9:07 pm | Permalink

    10 bucks says he just spends the rest of his days bitching about how the humorless feminazis ruined his life. While it’s inspiring how people on this board are attempting to illuminate and help young Alex, I personally happen to think ya’ll are giving the dude way, way too much credit. I do I applaud your hopefulness, though. You’re better women (and men) than I am.
    And maybe I’m just too much of a pessimist (or maybe I’ve just seen this situation too many goddamned times) but I don’t even really buy Haubrich. As eloquent as he’s been and as understanding and apologetic as he seems, I’m really, really skeptical that it’s not simply a “tell the hairy lesbians what they want to hear so we can get out of this alive and keep the university off our ass” type deal.
    I don’t feel good about it, but that’s my instinct, and I’m apologizing in advance for being such a negative Nancy, especially if I happen to be wrong (which we’ll really never know). I guess I’ve just learned over the years to take internet strangers with a grain of salt.

  20. Haubrich
    Posted April 19, 2008 at 9:44 pm | Permalink

    I know it may not be of any consolation but we at the SIU-C Republicans are outraged by what he said. I know there’s no way to totally convince you of this, but that’s all I can really say. I PERSONALLY am outraged as is the group.
    As to Alex’s apology, there is no way I can guarantee his sincerity, nor that he will really change although I hope for his sake and the sake of those around him that he can.

  21. Virago
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 12:43 am | Permalink

    I do not think that non feminist women are adorably dumb and that feminist women are “dumb cunts” and to be honest I do not even remember typing the aforementioned statement.
    -Alex Kochno
    You don’t remember typing that statement, and you think women are dumb? Or do you actually think women are so dumb that we are going to believe this load of crap? Geez, Alex, if your suppose to be an example of male intellectual superiority, there really isn’t any hope for the male half of the species.

  22. FSGinger
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 4:52 am | Permalink

    I have had the misfortune of being next to the SIUC College Republicans information table during the lunch hour on campus before, and I have to say that, despite all the backpeddling here, the statements Mr Kochno expressed in his email are not the only examples of sexism and misogyny that come from them. I have, on more than one occasion, stood there and listened as the College Republicans at SIUC laughingly talked about how women are inherently less rational, less smart, and less capable of effective leadership than men. I have heard them flat out state that they would “rather vote for a democratic man of any color than a woman” and then laugh about women’s pettiness and hormonal instability. It’s sickening. They clearly haven’t learned anything in their classes (like, oh, say, ones I have taught there?). But of course, we know that men deal with as many hormonal fluctuations as women (just oftentimes all in one day instead of spread out over a month), so maybe I caught them during a hormonal moment of the midday. ;)

  23. pointy bird
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 10:09 am | Permalink

    I hear ya, soymilk. And yet, Mr. Haubrich’s unwillingness to go the “really, he’s not usually like this” route seems the mark of a sincere response. I incline toward giving him the benefit of the doubt.

  24. pointy bird
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 10:12 am | Permalink

    Although … FSGinger’s point is well taken. What people say to their friends over lunch is generally very telling.

  25. Nick
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 10:16 am | Permalink

    Ditto with SoyMilk Conspiracy.
    As an added thought, after the last seven years, what sort of person advertises themselves as a Republican?
    Saying you support the Republican Party at this point is tantamount to saying: I support torture; propagandizing of the public (see recent NYT article, etc.); support unnecessary and wildly expensive wars; support huge budget deficits; and am naive enough not to have recognized the truckloads of B.S. that were fed to me about Iraq and the war on terror–but at least I oppose abortion and gays, and get to keep my assault rifles!
    And notice this group is having one of those clever bake sales designed to point out the unfairness of affirmative action. So darned clever and amusing.
    White people complaining about the unfairness of affirmative action tells you everything you need to know about how clueless this bunch is about the privileges most of them enjoy on the basis of their skin color and gender.
    Lack of genuine empathy is a hallmark of the modern Republican (and sociopaths everywhere).

  26. pointy bird
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 11:22 am | Permalink

    “but at least I oppose abortion and gays, and get to keep my assault rifles!”

  27. pointy bird
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 11:39 am | Permalink

    Re: “Hee!”
    Okay, I realize I’m swaying wildly between my angry feminist side and my high school teacher side, but …
    While you’ve exactly captured my feelings about the repulican party (minus the sociopath bit … that’s my mom you’re talkin’ about!), this may not be the proper thread for airing that. This thread has developed into a fairly civilized and, I think, worthwhile conversation about this one group’s treatment of women, specifically. And how can Haubrich really be expected to engage us in a conversation about The Republican Party at large?
    I’m not really interested in this turning into partisan debate, or making Mr. Haubrich defend his politics. Discussing the ONE issue of gendered hate speech will yield more valuable results, I feel.
    But still … hee!

  28. Ninapendamaishi
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 11:41 am | Permalink

    “I am an older feminist (67.5) and would ask that younger feminists using the term “douchebag” as a pejorative think about the meaning of the term and why and by whom it might be considered insulting. We certainly wouldn’t use “soap” or “washcloth” as an insult, would we?”
    Well, “douches” are actually bad for women, as they wash away the naturally healthful bacteria and increase the chances of infection. That is why I continue to use “douche” as an insult…

  29. lizadilly
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 2:11 pm | Permalink

    As I also suggested on BoingBoing:
    In honor of Alex Kochno and his new future as unemployable douche extraordinaire, may I propose a new internet term?
    (v) to unwittingly out your own vile character on the internet; to accidentally yet irreversibly smear your own reputation through trolling
    (n) one who has Kochnoed themselves
    Feel free to perfect the definition!

  30. Nick
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 2:14 pm | Permalink

    Pointy, I question Haubrich’s assertion that he and the other Republican Youth are ‘outraged’ by Kochno’s statements.
    We have a party dominated by white men. Their recent national chairman admitted that the GOP’s use of the Southern Strategy was racist and wrong.
    Yet here we have Haubrich and the other Republican Youth hosting an affirmative action bake sale, designed to show the essential unfairness of affirmative action (poor white males, having their skin privilege diminised).
    Do you think it’s a coincidence that of all the things they could be working on, they’re working on an issue involving aide to minorities?
    If it’s not the Islamofascists, it’s the Mexicans. If it’s not the Mexicans, it’s the Negroes. Or those damned women (or the gays–same difference).
    My point is that these folks have a demonstrated lack of empathy to go along with their xenophobic nativism. It’s not much of a step from whining about affirmative action to disparaging women.

  31. lizadilly
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 2:34 pm | Permalink

    Nick, SoyMilk, et al:
    I feel what you’re feeling regarding suspicions that the other members of this group may just be pandering to us feminists with the kind of PR sense that Kochno lacked. BUT I really think it dangerous and unproductive to throw those kinds of accusations around at this time. Their behavior has been genial so I think we can respond in kind.
    Kochno exposed his own identity along with his hate-filled inner thoughts, and in doing so exposed the full names of his fellow club officers. They did not come to Feministing on their own terms looking for a fight like he did, so let’s not use this forum to speculate about their prejudices, given the association with their real names.

  32. Posted April 20, 2008 at 3:55 pm | Permalink

    Nick, I love you. Thanks for saying what I didn’t have the balls to.
    Lizadilly, I’m SO not trying to pick a fight, and I’m not throwing around accusations. I just noticed that pretty much every single commenter on this board seemed to believe that Haubrich is speaking earnestly and I simply wanted to note that some people who have been following this thread are still skeptical – not necessarily because of Haubrich himself, but because of our past experiences. My feelings are COMPLETELY valid and I resent being told to pack it in because it might ruffle feathers. I wasn’t personally attacking him – I was merely noting that some of us have enough experience with this type of situation to know that resolution rarely comes this easily.
    Haubrich, I appreciate you taking the time to respond to me and reiterate your sincerity, and it’s noted. My suspicion isn’t a personal attack on you – it comes from years and years of listening to republicans and conservatives insist that they aren’t sexist and that they don’t hate women while, at the same time, completely dismissing the notion of privilege and advocating that women don’t deserve bodily sovereignty or equality of any kind. It may be unfair of me to judge you and make assumptions about your personal beliefs on sexism based on your political affiliation, but the party you identify yourself with has done a really shitty job of assuaging our concerns. It’s all well and good to come to this board in peace and put out fires, and lord knows we all appreciate the way you handled the situation, but at the end of the day…you’re still a republican, and it’s hard for me to pat you on the back for playing kissy face with the scary feminists when you’re probably going to punch the ballot in November for a dude that shits all over everything most of us here believe in. That’s not to say I don’t appreciate the symbolism of what you’ve done, and I’m not looking into starting a debate on conservatism. All I’m saying is some of our skepticism is a legitimate (and unfortunate) consequence of your political leanings, and I hope you can appreciate why.

  33. Nick
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 4:12 pm | Permalink

    My mom taught me that I’ll be judged by the company I keep; birds of a feather flock together.
    Similarly, I had a friend who used to say ‘Damn what they say, watch what they do.’
    As for politics, conservatism, etc.–we were raised in a nation that espoused the idea that all humans are created equal. That’s not just white humans, or humans with a penis, or only those humans who live within our borders.
    It was a radically liberal idea espoused by revolutionaries in the Declaration of Independence. We fought a civil war, in part to extend that notion to black Americans. We had to wait another 50 years to extend the franchise to women.
    Jim Crow laws were still on the books when I was born. Their effects are still being felt and will be after I’m dead. I’d rather have a finger cut off with a pruning shear than sit at a table with a bunch of white people selling cookies and mocking affirmative action.
    In my lifetime I’ve seen the Civil Rights movement, feminism, and gay rights all develop by groups asserting the American ideal for themselves. That fact that their acquisition of rights sometimes comes at my loss of white male prerogative doesn’t bother me a bit–it’s the fair and decent thing to do. And it’s the American thing to do.
    As for conservatism–I’m a conservative. I’m an active duty veteran from a family of active duty vets. I believe in service to my nation, and that we need to protect against sociopaths both foreign and domestic. I think we have to husband our resources, and safeguard ourselves against encroachment of government power on our freedoms.
    I was also raised a Catholic, of the Sermon on the Mount variety (if a stranger asks for your cloak, give it to him). I don’t care that the government takes a bit of my money to buy food and health care for those who don’t have enough, or those whose race was deliberately suppressed.
    But I’ll be damned if I’ll abide the money changers at the affirmative action bake sale.
    It’s all political.

  34. lizadilly
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 4:44 pm | Permalink

    @ TheSoyMilkConspiracy :
    Wow. I don’t recall telling you to pack it in, and I don’t think I gave you anything to resent, unless you’re just in a resentful mood.
    All I did was point out that if someone takes the time to sign up for an account at Feministing and apologize (on the behalf of someone else no less), ask how to make things right and try to be an ally, we should consider the consequences of slapping that down.
    I haven’t fallen all over myself with gratitude toward Haubrich et al precisely because of the suspicions you raised, but if there is the possibility of something good coming of this, eg, egg-faced republicans building bridges with feminists, I want to facilitate that.
    And I’m not sure where you get the idea that republicans are the only ones that shit on women’s issues. I would say the majority of politicians on both sides benefit from racial, heteronormative and male privilege, and the party line does not clearly divide those who support our causes and those who throw us under the bus. Writing off huge groups of people based on stereotypes never helped anyone — certainly not women.
    However if you think you’re making progress with your philosophy, by all means continue.

  35. Haubrich
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 4:50 pm | Permalink

    I apologize, I should have worded my statement more carefully. I did not view what you said as a personal attack, I merely wished to reiterate what I said above about my feelings and the group’s feelings towards Kochno’s statement.
    Do not worry about starting a debate, I am not looking for that either for the simple reason that its pretty irrelevant right now. I do think it may be relevant, as least to do something to clear my name, to give a brief summary of my views though, which I do below.
    As to the party, and I will speak as my self here, not in my capacity as secretary, I think much of what you said is valid. You may not care about my personal leanings, and that is understandable, but I do feel a need to at least somewhat clear my name here and I will keep this brief. I do not consider myself a republican in the GOP sense, although yes I was recruited by a friend into joining. I am actually the only libertarian that sits on our board, and the reason I am not a part of a campus libertarian group is because we do not have one and I do not have the time to start one. I voted for Paul in the primary, as well.
    As to punching the ballot, I think I will stay home in November or vote third party because I am not sold on the policies of either side.

  36. Haubrich
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 4:53 pm | Permalink

    I do not know where you are reading the idea of the “affirmative action bakesale” but if it is from the minutes from earlier in the year it should say it was voted down resoundly after it was brought up by Kochno.

  37. Haubrich
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 5:10 pm | Permalink

    Just my opinion, though. I tend to be king of pessimistic in terms of politics and I guess it shows.
    Anyway, I do appreciate the time on your fine blog. I have enjoyed the discourse with you all!

  38. MLEmac
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 5:11 pm | Permalink

    I do give Haubrich the benefit of the doubt, simply because he has kept his cool.
    Yesterday, I had lunch with my boyfriend and his extremely republican mother. She made many comments which I fundamentally disagreed with, but I stayed polite and kept the peace because I sincerely want her to like me, especially considering that her son had a nice hicky on the side of his neck that was facing her.
    I can imagine that Haubrich disagrees fundamentally with a number of things that have been said on this site, yet he has not turned any of his posts into anything slightly politically antagonizing to us. So, I appreciate that. I get the sense that he really does not want to be on our shit list. And if he just wanted to make sure the university stays off his group’s back, he probably could have just stopped after a couple of polite, submissive posts, but the fact that he continues to comment on our responses, makes me feel like he is adequately sincere.

  39. Haubrich
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 5:18 pm | Permalink

    I do appreciate that. And I think the reason I have at least tried to be engaged is because I do enjoy learning as much as I can about views that are different then mine.

  40. Raymer
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 7:50 pm | Permalink

    You have made comments here that are patently false. We do not stand at informational tables and spew misogyny. And not to get into politics, I would love to be able to vote for Condoleezza Rice.
    As Haubrich pointed out, this information about an affirmative action bake sale is incredibly out of date. And as for your “White people complaining about the unfairness of affirmative action� crack, not only am I not white, but I also have a disability and would never call myself “privileged.� And yet with these factors, I disagree with affirmative action on principle.
    I am not here to get into an argument, but I feel that I must defend myself and our organization against the spurious insult that we as an organization share the views of Kochno.

  41. kestrella
    Posted April 20, 2008 at 9:51 pm | Permalink

    Hi, I’m new here, so maybe it isn’t my place to comment on what happened.
    I do appreciate the fact that Haubrich has been courteous and has admitted to things he didn’t need to admit to (such as Alex’s apparent history of anti-Semitic slurs while drinking), which certainly implies candor.
    But I am curious why the club members elevated Alex to a position of importance if his “tendencies” were already known. I’m not trying to justify Alex’s behavior, or to hold anyone accountable for it but him, but it seems reasonable that a mind like Alex’s would take this as acceptance, if not outright approval, of his attitude.
    And finally, as someone old enough to be Alex’s mom…if the advisor is reading this, I hope something is being done to get Alex screened for his life-threatening alcohol problem. If he is indeed drinking so heavily that he is operating in blackout at 7am, he could easily get behind the wheel and kill someone without knowing where he is or drink himself to death. He may be a jackass, but I’d rather see him live to outgrow it than not.

  42. Posted April 20, 2008 at 10:08 pm | Permalink

    While I agree with the sentiment of publicly outing the sexist hatemailer, as an IT professional I must warn you that sending an email from a spoofed address is extremely easy to do. It looks like you got the right guy this time but I’m worried that you’re setting a dangerous precedent that others could abuse.
    I hope that you checked into this and made sure he was the guy before you outed him. And I really hope that you check any hatemail in the future before acting on it.
    It really is extremely easy to send a fake email. I could send you some sexist hatemail and make it look like it came from

  43. Posted April 20, 2008 at 11:51 pm | Permalink

    Thank you again for the clarification, Haubrich. I never felt like you were being defensive or taking my skepticism personally, I just wanted to make sure that you knew I wasn’t trying to personally attack you, especially since you have been courteous to everybody here. And anyway, how personal can you really get with strangers on the internet?
    I know I’m going to get skewered for derailing the thread here (which is not my intention), but I just can’t let this one thing slide: I can appreciate the fact that you’re not a republican in the GOP sense, but I do feel compelled to point out that Ron Paul is the most anti-choice candidate in this election, and terrifyingly so because nobody seems to know this or care about it. He is A#1 woman-hater supremo, and while I’m sure you couldn’t care less, supporting him earns you no credit in my book. Again though, I appreciate your clarification and totally understand why you felt the need to give it – feminists often have to do the same thing.

  44. FSGinger
    Posted April 21, 2008 at 12:03 am | Permalink

    I have no reason to lie about the SIUC College Republicans. I have had others with me when these conversations were going on at the info tables (undergrads who were disturbed by what they were hearing) and we had productive conversations about the roots of such “women are all hormonal and irrational and can’t be effective leaders” rhetoric afterwards. It was just frustrating and sad to have such a clear illustration right there on campus instead of having to read about it in books.

  45. kestrella
    Posted April 21, 2008 at 1:43 am | Permalink

    Again, maybe I’m butting in here as a newbie, but I’m glad you posted that. I for one was very troubled by the College Republican office holder calling you a liar about what you observed.
    Especially given that we know that they made an officer of a person known to have “chauvinistic tendencies”.
    Haubrich, maybe you weren’t there when these things happened, but I do not think it was acceptable for you to accuse a poster on this board (and apparently, a former faculty member of your university) of making “patently false claims” because she observed things you did not.

  46. Nick
    Posted April 21, 2008 at 9:01 am | Permalink

    1. February 6, 2008 Meeting Minutes
    Current mood: accomplished
    Category: School, College, Greek
    Old Business:
    Affirmative Action Bake Sale-Any ideas? Good times? All input is welcome!
    Respectfully submitted,
    Wess A. Haubrich
    (No indication that the Affirmative Action bake sale was voted down. Instead, a cheery ‘Any ideas?’.
    2. My statement that I would be ashamed to sit at a table with other privileged white people complaining about affirmative action for underprivileged minorities stands. Anti-affirmative action measures are driven by the politics of a party which uses racial fears for political gain (Willie Horton, cadillac queens, etc.).
    That not ALL of those opposing affirmative action are racists doesn’t matter–the taint is definitely there. And how are we going to sort them out–give a lie detector test and ask how they feel about the Confederate Flag?
    You can’t lie down with dogs without getting some fleas.

  47. Posted April 21, 2008 at 9:11 am | Permalink

    kestrella, just to clarify, it wasn’t Haubrich who accused FSGinger of lying. It was Raymer.

  48. Haubrich
    Posted April 21, 2008 at 11:43 am | Permalink

    Thank you for pointing that out (I had thought I had added that to the minutes). I should clarify that it was voted down at a later time…
    And that’s fine that you have your beliefs, but I hardly think it fair nor accurate to automatically assume the worst in a person when that person has given you no reason to do so.

  49. Jessica
    Posted April 21, 2008 at 1:46 pm | Permalink

    Haubrich and Raymer, thanks so much for coming here and being open to a conversation, and for the apologies. Alex, I have no idea how genuine your apology is, but I’m glad that you made it – and made it publicly.
    I’m shutting down this thread, and writing a post to update folks.
    Thanks to all.

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