Gotta love those comments though.

My computer needs some sort of shock delivery system to stop me from reading comments on pages like that. Now I feel all nauseous and outraged and it's not even 8AM here. Glenn Sacks is scary enough. His readers? Possibly a sign of the apocalypse.

I had no idea there was a war going on until I read those comments. I had the idea that I love men and that feminism was of benefit to them as well as to me. Those men seem to be very invested in a war of the sexes, especially the paranoid one who thought his kid's friend's mother looked at him accusingly. Paranoid much?

Ditto.

If you value your sanity, you will keep your eyes away from the comment section.

We have a long way to go :\

I shuld have read the warnings and avoided the comments section. Apparently, we should all be thanking 'tonysprout' for giving us the vote. What a champ! And there's nothing classier than comparing Hillary Clinton to Hitler right before wishing everyone a 'blessed' Veteran's Day.

Actually, I take that back.

We don't have a long way to go so much as they do... They are the ones living in their own pleasantly warped reality. They have a lot of catching up to do in the area of human decency.

The sad thing is the commenters don't realize what Mr. Sacks is trying to do. By saying "Ann was right" on this non-issue, he's trying to position himself as a voice of reason rather than a raving misogynist nutjob. But the commenters, raving misogynist nutjobs themselves, won't have it.

Bingo, Jeff.

I find the comments hilarious in their utter ignorance and downright stupidity. Especially "roger":

the comparison is ANYTHING but sexist.
it cannot be sexist because only 1 sex is being contrasted.
it may be something else.
but it is not sexist.

I think someone needs to give him a dictionary for Christmas. ;)

That whole website is a minefield of stupidity and misogyny. They also seem to be very discerning when it comes to comments posted there, as I posted a rational and level-headed comment on this article and it still seems to be in moderation. Perhaps they have a sanity filter.

I love how they comment on how prominent feminists are "middle aged" as if prominent misogynists weren't. The power structure of any ideology is almost always middle aged, whether that means Hillary Clinton or Bill O'Really. It's not a bad thing, either, IMHO.

Ugh -- I'm another who didn't heed the warnings and read the comments.

Now I realize that I'd better tell my husband that, as a feminist, I actually hate him. *eyeroll*

I don't have the stomach today to read those comments, but I did just want to say WAY TO GO, ANN! Maybe in this guy's warped, misogynist mind he thinks that being a Nice Guy(tm) might get him a date with you. Seems like the only explanation to me. And what a lucky woman you would be :)

I too can be added to the list of us who did not read/heed the warnings and have gone into this man-hating frenzy, because, that's what us feminists do, right? I mean, how many men have you eaten alive today girls?

"We were "decent" when we gave women the vote."
That's not being decent, that's ending a denial of civil liberties!

*grumble grumble*

I too can be added to the list of us who did not read/heed the warnings and have gone into this man-hating frenzy, because, that's what us feminists do, right? I mean, how many men have you eaten alive today girls?

"We were "decent" when we gave women the vote."
That's not being decent, that's ending a denial of civil liberties!

*grumble grumble*

The comments me think of that one xmas when my dad started the dinner conversation with "It all went to hell when we gave women the vote" (it was lovely to sit back and watch his sister tear him a new one)...

I do think my new word of the day is "ovary-think" though....

have any of you noticed that they have a woman writing for them ("Dr. Helen Smith") whose purpose seems to be to represent non-feminist women, and massage the male ego?

Check out her most recent advice column: http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/10/31/ask-dr-helen-should-men-get-married/

In this column she references a book called "Taken into Custody: The War Against Fatherhood, Marriage, and the Family,":

"In this book, Baskerville describes some horrific situations where men are called deadbeat dads and jailed (pdf file), fathers have their children taken away, false abuse charges ruin reputations and men lose their very lives by committing suicide after divorce decisions that leave them feeling impotent, destitute or without the people they love the most: their children."

And later on in the article, she adds: "So back to the question of should men get married? I say, do so with an open mind and realize that the legal system may be stacked against you."

Is Helen Smith really a woman? And a doctor, at that? If so I am surprised that she does not seem to realize that marriage is an institution that, obviously, though it can be egalitarian, primarily benefits men? Particularly fundamentalist, right-wing en, who it seems this internet magazine is aimed at? :\

OMFG! I had no idea! Prior to reading the comments I actually liked men just fine... even dated them! I had no idea I was defying the paradigm of what a feminist could be.... I need to leave work right now, get my Birkenstocks, grab a great big knife (I'm naming her Emasculator), and head out to do some man hating. I haven't even eaten man in, like, a month. So much to do, so little time. My partner is going to be so sad to find out that I need to become middle-aged, unattractive, and (presumably) a lesbian now, lest I cease to fit into the box the republi-bots decided I fit in. Damn. Damn, I say.

I can't even really be mad at those men. It's like getting mad at a cross eyed cat for running into your rose bowl. It's not their fault their brains don't function correctly. Seriously, that much hatred has to burn out vital neurological functions.

I generally try to ignore the comments on these types of articles, but can we please take a moment to giggle at the term "Ann Friendman's ovary-think"? What does that even mean?

i'm planning to get a tattoo, and my design includes a female symbol, but reading those comments gave me an idea. I think I will replace the whole tattoo with a picture of me stabbing a penis.......I think that would fit the feminist agenda a bit better.

Yiiiiiikes.

It's so charming when men believe 'men gave women the vote.' Like we don't ACTUALLY deserve it; men were just feeling generous that day and they can snatch it back if we don't behave. In reality, most of these bottom-feeders wouldn't have the vote either if they weren't landowners. So nice of the gentle upperclass to 'give' them the vote too!

The other thing I wanted to point out is that when conservatives/anti-feminists say they want to "protect marriage," what they mean is that they want to preserve male dominance.
If they truly wanted to "protect marriage" they'd advocate women's lib.

This comment is so god damned telling: [said of Hillary Clinton] "Frankly, she scares the wits out of me."

Yep, looks like this one's been scared wit-free, folks! Job well done, moving on...

I loved the rationalization that 9's and 10's (women, not #s) don't need female entitlement because men are willing to cater to them. Does that mean that only 9's and 10's are entitled to good treatment? Did they really just reveal that they are upset about feminism because "less attractive" women feel entitled without their consent? I love women but only if they shut up and listen to me!

To properly appeal to the notion of ovary-think, perhaps you could share your tattoo design, and we could consider it a new icon ;)

I read the comments as well. The one that stuck with me what the one about how a "feminist" tried to abort a boy and he managed to live anyway. Interesting that he pointed out that it was a "boy" and not just a "baby." I read the article cited. Nowhere in there does it say the woman is a feminist, but I guess the inference is that any woman who has an abortion is a feminist (that guy is pretty deluded as to who has abortions.) Anyway, I read the article, which is nothing like what he implies. The poor woman was told by her doctors that one twin was going to die and would likely kill his apparently healthy sibling, so they attempted to abort him, hoping to spare him eventual suffering, while saving his brother. The abortion didn't work. In fact, it apparently evened out the distribution of nutrition enough that both fetuses began to thrive. I'm not sure how this idiot posting seems to think this poor couple's difficult decision was something to do with feminism, and that the child's eventual survival was something to do with the inherent superiority of the male gender. Yes, I'm probably reading too much into it, but maybe not. I did learn that there are a lot of crazy and very bitter men out there. I didn't realize we feminists were that scary.

Bluepencils, great observation. Interesting and quite depressing.

There is a new comment on this article stating: "

The trouble is a whole lot of us have met a lot of "feminists" and we have been hearing about feminism one way or another just about everyday of our life and many of have yet to meet a feminist who actually believes in equality between men and women. If that were the case the "feminists" would have stopped taking all the privileges, special rights, and special advantages they have been hogging (the anaolgy fits) for decades now and accepted equal responsibilities with equal rights."

My younger brother once said this, to an effect, when he was roughly 10 or 11 years old. He asked why feminism was even needed anymore, and said this to my mother and myself at the dinner table, I belive (I was 14 or 15 at the time). I believe someone made the comment "ladies first" when serving food one time too many, which is kind of ironic really...

But who planted that idea in his mind? What leads men to believe that women have equal rights now, or more advantages than men? I don't get it...?

What leads men to believe that women have equal rights now, or more advantages than men? I don't get it...?

To put it simply, it's cognitive dissonance. Men, for the most part, don't think they're sexist. Deep down, they know that they live in a society that benefits men, and deep down, they like it. But liking the fact that they live in a society that puts women down in every sector makes them sexist, doesn't it? Not doing anything to combat sexism on an institutional level because doing so would put them one step closer to living in a society where they're not in control would make them really sexist. So they deny that they benefit from sexism in order to keep the idea that they're not sexist alive. Some might even deny that sexism exists to achieve the same goal.

Vanessa,

I had up until now been blissfully ignorant of the very existence of Men's News Daily. Now, having read the comments section of that article, I feel a need to smack myself silly for even owning Y-chromosomes. Thanks a lot!

I weep for my gender....

I believe someone made the comment "ladies first" when serving food one time too many, which is kind of ironic really...

Ah yes, the "ladies first" etiquette, which only existed on the (unspoken, but well conditioned) quid pro quo that the "ladies" never take too large a serve, or try to actually decide where the party might be going.

Overt deference, covert dominance.

wow FEmily, you articulated that so well. I'm currently working on a paper about that same train of thought, only my paper is about racism instead of sexism.

Why did I read the comments? Now, as a self identifying feminist with male bits, I have to hate myself. The website says so!

Heck, if I judged my entire gender based on the idiocy of that website I *definitely* would hate myself. Fortunantly, I can choose not to. That was close!

MLEmac: stabbing isn't quite evocative enough. Perhaps severing?

wow...i didn't read the warnings either! good thing, cuz i would have missed all the important information about myself. you all have been holding out on me! i can't believe nooone told me about the war on men! bring your women childz and your birkenstocks and ovaries to the rally at my place! my male roommates won't mind if we start the festivities here. they will be bummed to know i have to hate them now, but cest la vie, right...or is that viva la resistance?

One guy said that he has never met an attractive feminist. Hmmm, I don't know about that...I would consider myself attractive, and I am a feminist:

And who knew that feminists hated men? I'm a feminist who has had male best friends since elementary school. Oh, and my boyfriend is a feminist, does that mean he hates men too?

hpunzel,

I hope you don't mind, but I posted your comment on their site. I left out your name because I wasn't sure if you wanted people so full of hatred to know anything about you. I can add your credit, though, if you like.

Yes, severing probably would be a bit more accurate. Better yet, I'll draw a woman with hairy armpits and an axe hacking away at a penis the size of a tree trunk. It will be emasculating a man, and representing the fall of patriarchy.......I'll go get my sketchbook!

I've always wondered what, exactly, it takes to create the sort of personality that frequents that sort of website. I mean, it seems like they always have some sort of sob story about how some specific woman done them terribly wrong, and because of that, forever they will make the rest of the gender pay. It used to be completely alien to me.

Then I had some woman do me terribly wrong, and I realized that if I were a little (okay lot) less self-aware (and thus unable to see how I contributed to the situation, even being the wronged party), and more inclined toward snap judgments and defensive, guarded emotions...well, there but for the grace of god (by which I mean balanced, responsible-for-my-own-life mental state combined with a healthy, liberal upbringing) go I.

So now I look on such individuals with more pity than rage (though still both). Not for how they were wronged, but for how they allow all those negative responses to control their approach to life for the rest of eternity. No one on that thread who posted the ridiculous posts will ever be happy again. In a way, that could be revenge enough for their ridiculous posturing...if they kept it to themselves, at least. :/

MLEmac: I'm so glad I could contribute to the visual analogy that will be your patriarchy emasculating sketch. Even at this moment, I can imagine the testies of your male friends withdrawing in terror. If you had any, that is, because we all know feminists don't have male friends.

Like many others, I read the comments. I should never read the comments to news stories, no matter where. They're never good. I can't believe the simultaneously patronizing and dehumanizing tone of the men on that site.

Oh, I'm just plain impressed that Ann has transcended medical science and is able to think with her ovaries, according to Mr. Sacks.

Way to go, Ann!

Here's part of my favorite comment:

"On first thought, it seems Glenn is trying too hard to seem reasonable and treating the "enemy" too well. After all they treat us so bad. The golden rule is a good rule, but does it apply to our enemy?"

Anyone else feel just *so* sorry for them? I think what I find so astonishing isn't the misogyny but how blatant it is there.

"I would point out that there are DAMNED FEW attractive feminists, though, whatever you might believe about Susan Estrich.

Lack of attractiveness results in quite a few middle-aged, embittered women, women who are ready, willing, and able to declare war on men. They did not have a line of men vying for the right to support them and their life-choices, looked around for a convenient class of oppressor and learned in their Womyn's Studies that they were being oppressed by MEN all along!

9's and 10's among women generally do not NEED those artificially constructed entitlements and privileges for women - they have men willing and able to cater to their comforts and needs."

oh. my. god. i love having the basis of my feminist beliefs explained to me, especially when they are based on my physical appearance (which, apparently, is severely lacking)

"I would point out that there are DAMNED FEW attractive feminists, though, whatever you might believe about Susan Estrich.

Lack of attractiveness results in quite a few middle-aged, embittered women, women who are ready, willing, and able to declare war on men. They did not have a line of men vying for the right to support them and their life-choices, looked around for a convenient class of oppressor and learned in their Womyn's Studies that they were being oppressed by MEN all along!

9's and 10's among women generally do not NEED those artificially constructed entitlements and privileges for women - they have men willing and able to cater to their comforts and needs."

oh. my. god. i love having the basis of my feminist beliefs explained to me, especially when they are based on my physical appearance (which, apparently, is severely lacking)

oops, first time poster, sorry for the double post!

I *expected* some off-beat comments on that-thar blog, but DEAR JEEZUS, there aren't words for this one from mruffalo, a little way down the page:

"Feminist mom fails to abort ger child several times. Boy lives,

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=491443&in_page_id=1770"

Wow. Wow wow wow... 'Cause she surely was just a 'nasty selfish ol feminist wanting to get rid of her precious baby' rather than a woman who made the CHOICE when she got pregnant, to keep the babies, and the later agonized decision to abort one after it looked like he would suffer and die terribly if he even made it to birth. The kid's a freakin' miracle, no disputing it. But... man. Amazing how folks can paint with colors that don't even exist.

Not to mention the comment was *entirely* out of context. It's... just... all kinds of special. My mind has just been blown by the stupid.

Young men often make irrrational comments because none of us initially understand what is happening and who is persecuting us. We incorrectly believe that we have protected rights in this country. Allow me to paste a sample of a comment from Glenn's blog:
"The people holding this system in its current death grip against fathers are those with massive, repeat MASSIVE, economic interests to protect. That is not the feminists folks. I see them as a sideshow which would fade away if those who are truly protecting and promoting this system were chased away and had their child-kidnapping and money-stealing industry shut down."
I absolutely agree with this comment. Feminists and ex's are not our true enemies, just the tools of the divorce industry, which is destroying all of our families, to include mothers along with fathers!

Young men often make irrrational comments because none of us initially understand what is happening and who is persecuting us. We incorrectly believe that we have protected rights in this country. Allow me to paste a sample of a comment from Glenn's blog:
"The people holding this system in its current death grip against fathers are those with massive, repeat MASSIVE, economic interests to protect. That is not the feminists folks. I see them as a sideshow which would fade away if those who are truly protecting and promoting this system were chased away and had their child-kidnapping and money-stealing industry shut down."
I absolutely agree with this comment. Feminists and ex's are not our true enemies, just the tools of the divorce industry, which is destroying all of our families, to include mothers along with fathers!