What bothers me about this is that they're putting the onus on parents to talk to their kids while simultaneously competing with the parents' message. Most parents aren't really a match for the beauty industry.

Obviously it is just a marketing ploy to make Dove products seem benign in the beauty industry, like you would be turning your back on the superficial stuff by buying their soap/cleanser/shampoo. It's sad that the marketing of a product has come down to betraying the industry, instead of changing it.

Still, I think using lotion and deodorant is quite different from Botoxing, bleaching, and implanting. I mean, doesn't everyone use lotion and deodorant?

This reminds me of sort of the cig industry and all of its "wait-until-you're-18" messages. It's merely a way of saying, "Look at us, we might be creating a harmful product, but at least we're responsible about it."

Marc is not impressed with this. :[

Point is, when it comes to body image, better spokespersons would be those at your campus' FMLA clubs or performers for Love Your Body Day.

Yeah, Rock Star, but they also sell "firming" cream & all that "pro.age" anti-aging stuff too. And some of their deodorant commercials tout the product's ability to give you smoother, prettier underarms. Yay! Another body part to obsess about!

Plus Unilever makes Axe and the whitening cream sold in India.

Wow, this is pretty complicated. I love the video and the concept but it certainly does conflict with the company(ies) involved.

I think I am going to cautiously side with Dove here, especially due to my limited understanding of how "parent companies" truly operate.

I do have trouble reconciling this message but I have to believe that they are making a step in the right direction. This video made me think- of course, I already agreed with their message but I would hope that even those who didn't would be affected by this video.

I am not one of those "something is better than nothing" people but this "Something" is significant.

Yeah, I've never thought about it, but there are a lot of comparisons one could make between this and tobacco's companies in vying for public support.

However, unlike cigarettes, which just look like desperate fools when they try those sorts of moves nowadays, Dove is being taken really serious. It's not all bad, if it gets people to talk about the issue. It IS bad though , when its heart is all about making profits.

It's just a shame that Dove and the massive amounts of money behind selling it weren't available to groups that tout the same message but that's all they tout, and not the ability to turn your fat and fabulous thighs as smooth as marble, as well. Because we all know fat is only okay if you're body resembles that of a giant, porcelain doll.

I'll give Dove one thing. That commercial is creepy as hell. Side note: Whenever I saw the "smoother" underarms commercial, I thought they were talking about a moisturizer in the deodorant that would help with razor burn/bumps, that are uncomfortable, not just "unsightly."

Hard to reconcile? They want to make money! Listen to Bill Hicks!

Jessica, you hit the nail on the head as to why I don't get too excited about Dove's "Campaign for Real Beauty." At the end of the day, they're still trying to get me to buy their shit, which is beauty products. An advertising message that says "Real women buy Dove" doesn't do a thing to solve any real problems with society (although I do like how they're donating to women's organizations). Still, if I wanted to make that kind of difference, I'd make the donation myself (assuming I had disposable income... hee). Just like if I wanted to donate to breast cancer research, the best thing to do is to donate directly to the research organization, instead of buying a bunch of pink shit.

This is kind of off topic... A friend of mine had some advice to share with women who have the misfortune of being in the (straight) dating game.

You buy a small bottle of AXE (no, really). Then, familiarize yourself with the scent.

Finally, if you smell it on your date, activate the "emergency friend rescue system" and/or escape out the back door.

The idea is that people should actually thank the makers of AXE. It's like an asshole early warning alarm or something!

Was I the only one completely weirded out by the drug commercial women all wearing the same zombie expression? It was really noticeable when they all started flicking by really fast.

And while I don't remember who was remarking upon Dove's deodorant giving you soft skin, I want to say this: I will ONLY use Dove deodorant. It doesn't make my pitties softer, but I have seen a marked decrease in underarm irritation since I began using their BO sticks!

This video pisses me off even more than the last one. SarahMC has it exactly right -- telling parents to talk to their daughters about self-esteem while the "beauty" industry spends billions to persuade girls otherwise. Right.

What I'd love to see is a corporation that will lose some revenue by pledging not to advertise to children (as Dove does with their "Girls Only Interactive Self-Esteem Zone").

Quit using my daughter's insecurites to build your brand loyalty.

I think the ad isn't very helpful.

It's like a cigarette ad that flashes 30 images of movie stars smoking and looking cool (and then a couple scary images) and then saying "Don't smoke - it's not school".

I'm not convinced that flashing 30 images of slender women coupled with a couple negative ones is any better than an ad just flashing 3-4 images of slender women.

Ok, sure, I understand that Dove is being fairly hypocritical (although not to the point of negating everything in the ad.. Dove is certainly not selling cosmetic surgery). BUT I still LOVE the ad. I'd much rather turn on the TV and see THIS interspersed into the mindless line of typical commercials than to not see it at all! Yeah, I'd probably think that Dove has another agenda, but I don't think that's the point. They're sending a GOOD message, and I think that's what really matters right now. You have to start somewhere, and I promise it's not going to be perfection. You have to build towards that.

Seriously cool video (regardless of who made it).

Whoops: "It's not cool", not "it's not school".

Forbidden, but Axe users should be given the benefit of the doubt! I once lost my bottle of cologne and borrowed my roommate's Axe ...I'd never felt so ...douchbaggy in my life, but at least I didn't smell like ass and musk on the date.

What about talking to sons, about how the "images" of beauty are fakes?

I'm not so sure I agree with all the comments... We don't like the beauty industry. Fine. But we are apart of it - involved in it - walk amongst it. I like to paint my fingernails. I like to wear mascara. I like to condition my hair. I don't like to have hair above my upper lip. Does that make me any less of a feminist? No. So where exactly am I supposed to get my beauty products from? Wouldn't you rather buy your conditioner from a company that is at least trying to do something - anything - to address the lofty and unrealistic ideals put upon women by the beauty and fashion industries? Of course they're just trying to sell their products - that's what they are in business to do - sell us shit. And you know what? I want to buy it because I don't my hair to be frizzy or my skin to be scaly. And I appreciate a company that at least has the decency to say, hey, you should buy this lotion, but maybe at some point you should also stop and think about what you're doing to yourself and your body and why, exactly, you have the need to do it in order to feel good.

Rather than deny the fact that many if not most women want to look and feel beautiful, why don't we acknowledge exactly what it is Dove is trying to do? They're attempting to expand the definition of beauty to fit a variety of skin tones, body types, and looks so that more women can feel like they are validly "beautiful." So yes, they are selling anti-aging creams and firming lotions and anti-cellulite creams - but why is all of that necessarily bad? Is it so awful to want to look good or to acknowledge how important looking good is to some women? By expanding the definition of beauty rather than pretending people don't care about it, Dove is, in my opinion, helping women, NOT hurting them. The desire for beauty isn't going to go away anytime soon - women have literally been using makeup since antiquity - so I think we should support efforts to expand the definition of it.

I like the Dove ads. To me, they acknowledge something that most beauty ads do not -- that the reality of women's lives do not match up with beauty industry standards. I think just acknowledging that is HUGE and can only lead to better things. The mere existence of the Dove ads starts to chip away at the lie we've been told that we must all look like sex goddess supermodels. Now that Dove has stepped out of line with their advertising, a crack in the industry's facade has been revealed -- they no longer have a united front for lie-telling. I think that in the end makes it easier for women to reject unattainable standards. If everyone's telling you to get Botox or a boob job, you might actually do it -- but if there's even one voice sending a different message, that might change things in your head, especially for young girls.

I like the Dove ads. To me, they acknowledge something that most beauty ads do not -- that the reality of women's lives do not match up with beauty industry standards. I think just acknowledging that is HUGE and can only lead to better things. The mere existence of the Dove ads starts to chip away at the lie we've been told that we must all look like sex goddess supermodels. Now that Dove has stepped out of line with their advertising, a crack in the industry's facade has been revealed -- they no longer have a united front for lie-telling. I think that in the end makes it easier for women to reject unattainable standards. If everyone's telling you to get Botox or a boob job, you might actually do it -- but if there's even one voice sending a different message, that might change things in your head, especially for young girls.

Thank you, sarahd_lush & raginfem, I feel like you truly hit the nail on the head for me :)

How is it that my parents were successful in breaking through this illegged impenetrable media control over my self-esteem? I like this commercial because it is encouraging discussion BEFORE the media onslaught should take place in a child's life. I may not respect the company as a whole...as I don't with tobaccoo companies...but that doesn't mean the message becomes inherently bad because it is put out there by the companies that participate in the behavior they are advertising against. It just means a parent is responsible for eventually enlightening their child on that sad fact once they are old enough to grasp that concept. I agree with you sarahd_lush...I like seeing money being spent by Dove to promote this message. However, that means neither that I agree with the company as a whole nor am I then immediately brainwashed by that company because I like the ad.

We can agree that Dove is being hypocritical, but I also have to agree with some of the comments that it is a commercial I would love to see mingled with others on primetime. I have seen giant billboards with women over 50 (gasp!) in underwear advertising Dove stuff - and I couldn't stop staring. I actually thought to myself "Whahh? Really? [smile] About time!" Bringing women of all shapes and sizes into the public gaze sends a powerful message and argues against the fallacy of what a woman is supposed to look like. Besides, I love the UN-aspect of the commercial with all the different ethnic groups.

Unilever, on the whole, is a decent company. They've done public health/hygiene campaigns, partnered with international development agencies, they a leader in developing products for lower income markets by putting them into smaller per-use packages, and they also are pretty proactive in terms of environmental sustainability.

I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. They are trying to sell us beauty product, but I agree with sarahd_lush & raginfem. If Dove can help to expand the current definition of beauty for young girls, that's great.

Of course, I'm not really sure how Axe fits into all of this corporate responsibility. Unless it really is to warn us ladies off the douchebags (sorry ProFeministMale :), there's an exception to every rule).

I agree wholeheartedly with Allytude. What about our sons? Why aren't we focused on instilling them with an appreciation for natural beauty and looking past physical "imperfections"? After all, why do women care so much about smooth skin and botox and anti-aging cream? Because men expect their women to be skinny and young, just like the women they see in magazines and advertisements. If women did not have the societal pressure from the opposite sex to look a certain way, would any of this even be an issue?

Dove's ads are very appealing because we want to believe that 'they' want to help 'us'. Unilever/Dove's market research found that today's young women are turned off by guilt-inducing beauty ads, and are drawn to ideas about empowerment and activism. Hence the Campaign for Real Beauty: it's a response to the market's preferences, nothing more or less, to me. They had to figure out a way to shill this, and appealing to our desire to reject beauty standards (whilst consuming beauty products)seems to be working. But is it better than the alternative(s)? Sure! I guess... although the headf*ck that is the Pro-age anti-ageing line takes some logical leaps. Sure, you can age baby...just don't look like you are.
Finally, to respond to sarahd_lush's rhetorical question, yes - to some people, bleaching/waxing and makeup does make you less of a feminist. If it doesn't affect your perception of yourself, then great and fine. But some would argue that your personal choice to avoid frizziness/scaliness comes from wanting to identify with success and power; in our culture, the pretty, sexy woman is preferred. I just wanted to point out that while the vogueish definition of feminism is 'whatever I want it to be', there are those of us who really feel that these areas are incompatible.

"Sure, you can age baby...just don't look like you are.
Finally, to respond to sarahd_lush's rhetorical question, yes - to some people, bleaching/waxing and makeup does make you less of a feminist. "

Damn, that's harsh.

Okay, it took me a couple minutes to figure out why I had a negative emotional reaction to this statement: "yes - to some people, bleaching/waxing and makeup does make you less of a feminist"

That puts women in quite a bind. If you reject the dominant cultural ideal and don't wax, you are rejected by mainstream society. That sucks.

If you enact the dominant cultural ideal and do wax, you are rejected by fellow feminists who now have their own set of body ideals you must conform too (i.e., don't wax or you are not a feminist). That sucks.

It's a lose-lose situation.

It seems like a really tough line to walk - combatting the prevalent body ideals versus respecting women's right to make their own choices about their body, even if they align with those prevalent body ideals. I don't really have an answer for that one.

TheSlant and allytude, I think women are much harder on other women than men. My husband is the LAST one to notice if I have pimples, stretchmarks, wrinkles, etc., and even then it's only because I've pointed them out. Girls and women are notorious for tearing each other down. I really don't think guys care that much. I appreciate the message going out to young girls--I see way too many of them in my job, even at very young ages, overly concerned with their appearances. And even as girls, they're not showing off for the boys. They're showing off for each other.

(Man, I'm glad I'm not in middle school or high school anymore.)

I just want to strongly recommend the KILLING US SOFTLY series. It's EXCELLENT!

GO WATCH!!!

I definitely get the attitude that if you want to help a cause, you should donate directly. On the other hand (like the product red stuff), I was going to buy my best friend an ipod anyway, and if the cost is the same (sometimes it's not), why not buy the one that contributes to the AIDS fund? If you're going to buy soap and lotion anyway, why not buy the soap and lotion that gives money to a worthy cause? I mean, going out of your way to buy this stuff, isn't really great philanthropy, but if you can make a little difference by purchasing the stuff you always do, I think that's a good thing.

Also, though there are ulterior motives, I'm still glad to see ads that actually portray an array of body types, ages, skin colors, etc. Women over 50 with their skin out in the open being portrayed as beautiful helps, even if it is there to get you to buy facewash. Again, since they were going to try to get me to buy skin cream anyway, they might as well do it with women who look like real people, instead of porcelain skinned, eight-foot tall, unbelievably-skinny-with magically-giant-gravity defying-breasted women, who also happen to be generally white with blonde hair and who've never had a blemish in their lives.

Also, for the "pro.age" anti-aging stuff, I'm not sure how I feel about the wrinkle cream, but mature skin and hair actually does need more moisture to keep it healthy and protected. I don't think companies should be slammed for having special lines created for older skin any more than they would need to be for having a line of acne products. Different skin/hair types need different treatment.

But some would argue that your personal choice to avoid frizziness/scaliness comes from wanting to identify with success and power; in our culture...

My personal choice to avoid scaliness (and dandruff for that matter) comes from wanting to nourish and protect my largest organ. Scaly skin is not healthy, and it doesn't make me less of a feminist to use body lotion, even if it is mango scented.

sarahd_lush, i completely agree.

a capitalist economy isn't fueled by rainbows and unicorns and hugs; people are always going to be trying to sell you shit, that's how it works. accepting some degree of self-interested advertising as a given, i'd rather said advertising communicate a positive message.

I want to say up front that I don't watch commercials on TV. I rent shows I want to see, so I'm not beaten over the head with ads quite as much as your average American and thus am less likely to grow to hate them. That being said, I see these Dove ads as a positive force. They ask people to think about advertising rather than mindlessly consume it, always a good thing. While Dove does sell beauty products, they have taken the approach of offering them, but not requiring them. They actively reject the idea that there is one kind of beauty or that you are some how sub-human and unlovable if you don't participate. I'd say advertising a product without deliberately exacerbating insecurities and demanding conformity is a pretty huge step. Particularly since taking this tactic steps outside of tried and true marketing and invites criticism.

I also don't get, and kind of object, to all the hate towards anyone that uses a certain product such as Axe. Yes, the ads are stupid and offensive. Why is it when women buy into the idea that they must do X to be attractive and acceptable, they are victims of the beauty industry but when men do the same, they're just douche bags? It's still trading on insecurities and wanting to be wanted. (cue Cheap Trick song) The idea that men have to employ certain tactics to get women to like them, otherwise they're not Manly and consequently become social pariahs, is still damaging to self-esteem. I don't subscribe to the double standard that woman's insecurities are awful but men's insecurities are funny.

Completely off topic.

Roni, you're artwork is amazing!!!

I highly recommend Ted Chiang's "Liking What You See" (collected in Stories of Your Life) for a fictional take on this topic: It concerns a treatment that negates the brain's ability to rate attractiveness.
There's a specific comment by one character on the beauty/drug analogy: Normal everyday beauty is coca (a pleasant stimulant that makes the day pass a little better), the stuff that comes out of the glamor industry and fashion magazines is crack.

"I'm not convinced that flashing 30 images of slender women coupled with a couple negative ones is any better than an ad just flashing 3-4 images of slender women."

The point is that they're ALL negative images. I broke out into tears as soon as the montage of images started. What those ads do is emotional abuse.

And fuck Dove for co-opting. We're not stupid.

"Unilever, on the whole, is a decent company."

I have to disagree. Any company that participates in the racist health hazard that is skin bleaching in Africa and Asia is on the "not decent" list in my book. (See Wikipedia and National Geographic for more about skin bleaching.

As far as this commercial goes, it means that I hold Dove in higher regard than I do some other skin treatment companies. That's not saying much. The commercial is great, but it is, at the end of the day, a marketing ploy. They hope that we will buy more Dove products because they make nice videos.

And for whoever said that everyone uses deodorant and lotion, I beg to differ. I haven't used deodorant in years (allergy). I put some cornstarch in sweaty places, and call it a day. No one has ever told me I smelled, not even the people I asked to do so if it was a problem, like my mom and my best friend. I didn't use lotion for years, either. These are not human needs that Dove is fulfilling. They are manufactured needs that Dove is (along with the rest of the beauty industry) creating. I'm not saying that deodorant