Myra Strober, a Stanford professor, recounts an experience she had 40 years ago applying to grad school at Harvard in Econ. The professor interviewing her asked, "Are you normal?"
Meaning, do you want to get married and have children. When she responded that she was married, he couldn't understand why she would want/need a PhD. Strober discusses how this stuck with her and forced her to choose going to MIT which had a more progressive outlook on women in higher ed. She emphasizes this was 40 years ago, before educators understood the role of social factors in educational outcomes.
Today, we do understand that social circumstances affect how different groups of people learn. Strober wonders, "How do female students at Harvard feel knowing that the leader of their institution sees them as lesser? And does Harvard still think that it is "abnormal" for women to want families and high-powered careers?" I am wondering the same thing!
As it is, Harvard is considered the world leader in science and math research among other disciplines and often sets the precedent for many powerful decisions. Our country is certainly peppered by Harvard grads both in politics and business. What happens there does in some way affect dominant norms in the country. Unfortunately, it doesn't feel like Harvard has changed much with regard to their beliefs about the place/space that women SHOULD occupy.
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I don't know if anyone's posted this already here, but Slate magazine had a great article about this debacle called "Don't Let Larry Summers Off the Hook Just Yet":
http://slate.msn.com/id/2112799/
If there's an overrepresentation of men in prison, it's because they deserve to be there. But if there's an excess of males in the top 1% of academia, that's evidence of too much male privilege. It's just that simple!
It's sad, but it's not just Harvard. My friend's mom, back when she was getting her masters in Chemistry at Texas A&M, was told by the head of her program to go "and find a husband in an easier subject." But she stayed in the program and graduated anyway.
Funny, my mom got married (and had me) in college, while working, while taking a full course load, while being managing editor of the UNLV student paper. And got her masters. Then she went on to start a career AND support a family. She's a DPSM now, with two kids and two parents in the house. I completely fail to see how wanting to start a family in any way means a women doesn't want/need higher education. In fact, these days, the diploma or PhD is twice as useful in being able to support a family.
Hmm, seems Voxper narrowly beat me out for getting to be the second to post.
Question(s), Vox:
Who said more men deserved to be in prison, exactly? Or are you just coming up with generalities and applying them to everyone who posts here? Again.
Texas tends to randomly execute/imprison probably-innocent and mentally retarded people; I don't believe many males or females here are incarcerated for good reason. But you couldn't be bothered to take a group poll before saying anything, now could you?
i just find it interesting that Voxper associates women being in science with imprisonment...
Nice post Sami! You should all check out this commentary, also about Summers' assinine comments and the choices women are forced to make:
http://news.pacificnews.org/news/view_article.html?article_id=fe900bd5f2fe4e86b902b57c401d13fe
Jess- I'm refering to an ingrained habit of looking-up at the topmost extremes and saying that a lack of women there is because of male privilege, but ignoring the preponderance of men at the bottom extremes-- which might cast a little bit of doubt on the whole 'male privilege' accusation.
Only a willfully obtuse person could make the conclusion that you did.
(Not unrelated to Larry Summers, the Harvard linguist Steven Pinker said to the Harvard Crimson that anyone who would storm out of a room at the mention of an idea probably doesn't get the concept of a university. A person who claims to be so frightfully offended by Larry's words might be too delicate to leave their own home.)
Right. Because Steven Pinker is a totally disinterested participant in this discussion.
People walk out of talks all the time. And since you apparently know so much about academia, Vox, I'm sure you're aware of how much specialists like being lectured to by non-specialists about their area of expertise. You might sound less like a jerk if you stop thinking about Nancy Hopkins as a hysterical woman and start thinking about her as a full professor of genetics who doesn't like being lectured to about genetic theory by some arrogant economist who thinks his totalizing theory explains the entire world. She's not "delicate": she has the same professional pride that anyone who devotes decades of their life to studying something does.
I feel like a fucking broken record here. I know you're not the sharpest tool in the shed, but really. How many times does this have to be explained to you?
Well, Sally, I think that it will take at LEAST 4 more women explaining it to him to get it. I'm sure if you got your husband/boyfriend to explain it there wouldn't be any more repeating needed. Just a thought.
Sally- I might not have your enormous brain, but I don't make it a habit of trying to win arguments by making lemon-faces and acting hurt & offended in order to manipulate people's protective instincts.
It's an updated version of a woman pretending to faint upon hearing vulgarity. It makes lots of people rush to her side and stand-up for the little lady in distress. "Fetch the smelling salts! Have that vile brute removed from the room!" Ahh, how empowering that must be...
I don't understand what Summers said that is so wrong. I have a sister who is mentally disabled due to a birth defect, and thus I have spent considerable time working with the learning disabled and the mentally retarded and I can tell you from my own experience that there are far more men with learning disabilities and low IQs than there are women. So why is it so difficult to believe that there might be more men at the very upper ends of the IQ scale as well? Or are we to believe that there are just as many women geniuses as there are men (despite their relative absence throughout history) but far fewer women morons? If so, why should this be?