Luck of the Irish my ass.

This is just fucked:

A 17-year-old girl who is four months pregnant and whose child cannot survive outside the womb has gone to the High Court to challenge a decision by the Health Service Executive to stop her leaving the State for an abortion.
The girl is in the care of the HSE and is challenging its decision to contact gardaí and not to let her travel for the abortion unless she presented as a suicide risk.
After hearing this news, the girl made a decision to travel to the UK for a termination but the HSE asked gardaí not to permit her to leave the jurisdiction.

So this girl will literally be held by the police (gardaí ) if she tries to leave. It’s sickening. She’s challenging the ruling in court tomorrow; our thoughts are with her.

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43 Comments

  1. oenophile
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 7:25 pm | Permalink

    Stupid question: does “not survive outside the womb” refer to the condition of every 4-month old fetus (not viable), or is the girl pregnant with a child with severe abnormalities?

  2. lily cain
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 7:45 pm | Permalink

    oenophile, here‘s a link to an article – the fetus has a large part of its brain missing.
    this is completely fucked. my heart is with this poor girl.

  3. lily cain
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 7:50 pm | Permalink

    crumbs, didn’t work. sorry, couldn’t figure out how to do a link. but the fetus has anencephaly, a condition that allows a baby to live on average three days after being born.

  4. Posted April 30, 2007 at 7:53 pm | Permalink

    Not that the system doesn’t need to be fixed, but she should threaten suicide as an act of civil disobedience (the threat, not the action.) If you can’t go without presenting as suicidal – present as suicidal.

  5. oenophile
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:14 pm | Permalink

    Thanks – for some reason, I looked at the post and could not figure out where the article was.
    That’s so incredibly sad. There is NO good way to end this – nothing good can come out of bearing a child so developmentally disabled as to die shortly after birth.
    I know this will shock y’all, but I frankly don’t care if women have abortions in situations like this. In fact, it’s preferable: if she can abort before her child is capable of experiencing pain, it will suffer less. There’s something inhumane about letting a child die on an operating table.

  6. sunburned counsel
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:27 pm | Permalink

    This IS the luck of the Irish.
    Plague, famine, the English, more famine, a bunch of uprisings, and last, but not least, this most recent present from Catholicism

  7. LindsayPW
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:29 pm | Permalink

    I agree oenophile. We need laws that won’t allow a government to bar someone from leaving the country. This reeks of injustice. The people holding her there should have to witness every moment of this baby dying on an operating table and they should be charged with torture. I hate this world. Anyone want to rent a boat, go get this girl and take her to England?

  8. sunburned counsel
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:36 pm | Permalink

    oh, and unfortunately this is pretty much par for the course for the HSE.

  9. dinogirl
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:36 pm | Permalink

    I’m Irish and this is so not surprising. The cornerstone of Irish government policy on abortion has been a fucked-up reliance on the fact that England is only a boat ride away. So politicians wash their hands of the whole situation and pretend they don’t notice, while paying homage to the Catholic Church.
    We have a general election next month, and I hope that at the very least this young woman’s situation might galvanise some politicians to start standing up for choice. NOBODY wants to stick their heads over the parapet, they’d rather hope the whole thing goes away. And because England’s so close, women who might make a stand (understandably, obviously, I’m not criticising them) just choose to go quietly over to England. We’ll never have a Roe v Wade because the courts are as cowardly as the politicians, and no major party will risk the ire of the Church by running on a pro-choice platform EVEN THOUGH THE MAJORITY OF IRISH VOTERS ARE PRO-CHOICE. But the good old boys in power are completely and utterly out of touch with everyone under 40, and they’re not going to do anything. It make me so angry.
    And the only time this ever gets challenged is by young women. The X Case (about 15 years ago now) established that a 13 year old girl threatening suicide if she was not allowed to terminate her pregnancy qualified under the ‘threat to the health of the mother’ exception. The poor girl was put through the wringer. (Her rapist, incidentally, spent a ridiculously short amount of time in prison. But I digress). And do you know how the politicians reacted? They brought a referendum proposing to END the suicide execption and make it illegal for pregnant women to leave the country to pursue an abortion (how they ever proposed enforcing this, I don’t know). That referendum was defeated, thankfully, because as I said before most Irish people ARE pro-choice. Our politicians are just wankers.
    So in the last, oh twenty years, we have had the opportunity to vote to either make abortion illegal, or REALLY REALLY illegal. Thanks a lot, democracy.
    God, it amkes me so angry. Sorry for ranting. Will happily go into more detail on any of the above – I was young when the X case happened but boy, do I remember it.
    And since Portugal saw the light, are we now the ONLY Western nation to restrict reproductive choice?

  10. dinogirl
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:39 pm | Permalink

    Oh, yes sunburned counsel, this is the HSE that last weekend, let two parents kill themselves and their children, then claimed it wasn’t their responsibility because, hey, they’re closed on the weekend.

  11. mirm
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:39 pm | Permalink

    I was going to explain the X and Miss C cases, but dinogirl filled you in. It looks like the Republic will never learn.

  12. werechick
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 8:47 pm | Permalink

    Poor kid. (both of them, the 17 yo, and the kid she’s being forced to have, only to die)
    I don’t understand how anyone could oppose abortion at all in this case. I mean, even people with dying animals have the decency to put them to sleep rather than die like that.

  13. dinogirl
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 9:20 pm | Permalink

    What I just don’t understand is why NOT ONE of the political parties will make a stand for reproductive choice.
    This has riled me so much, I’ve just been to every party’s web page to try and find ONE REFERENCE to this issue. There’s nothing. Not even from the feckin Socialist Workers.
    The Greens and Labour are the only two who even have a ‘Women’ section. (admittedly, their policies are good – more parliamentary representation, better childcare, good stuff) but NO MENTION of abortion. Nothing on free contraception either.
    They’re all such goddamn cowards. You know, Ireland really is a different country to the one it used to be. Relative to the rest of the world, it’s not a bad place to be a woman. But the politicians are like dinosaurs. It’s the church influence, but it doesn’t make sense any more because most people don’t CARE what the bishops think and WOULD support a politician who made this an issue.
    My vote is there for the taking. I’ll give it to anyone – ANYONE (even McDowell) who stands up and says ‘What is happening to this girl is wrong. We need to change the constitution and start providing safe, legal abortions IN IRELAND.’
    But none of them will.
    On a slightly happier note, kudos, feministing for running this story before any of the Irish feminist blogs I watch. Ever since I saw the headline I’ve been watching for somewhere to talk about it. So thanks.
    Does anyone (especially Irish women) have any ideas for stuff we can DO about this? I want to channel some anger :-)

  14. dinogirl
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 9:22 pm | Permalink

    What I just don’t understand is why NOT ONE of the political parties will make a stand for reproductive choice.
    This has riled me so much, I’ve just been to every party’s web page to try and find ONE REFERENCE to this issue. There’s nothing. Not even from the feckin Socialist Workers.
    The Greens and Labour are the only two who even have a ‘Women’ section. (admittedly, their policies are good – more parliamentary representation, better childcare, good stuff) but NO MENTION of abortion. Nothing on free contraception either.
    They’re all such goddamn cowards. You know, Ireland really is a different country to the one it used to be. Relative to the rest of the world, it’s not a bad place to be a woman. But the politicians are like dinosaurs. It’s the church influence, but it doesn’t make sense any more because most people don’t CARE what the bishops think and WOULD support a politician who made this an issue.
    My vote is there for the taking. I’ll give it to anyone – ANYONE (even McDowell) who stands up and says ‘What is happening to this girl is wrong. We need to change the constitution and start providing safe, legal abortions IN IRELAND.’
    But none of them will.
    On a slightly happier note, kudos, feministing for running this story before any of the Irish feminist blogs I watch. Ever since I saw the headline I’ve been watching for somewhere to talk about it. So thanks.
    Does anyone (especially Irish women) have any ideas for stuff we can DO about this? I want to channel some anger :-)

  15. Posted April 30, 2007 at 9:50 pm | Permalink

    When I was four, my mother gave birth to a girl with anencephaly. Naturally, my sister died just a few days later; and my mother hemorrhaged while giving birth and literally bled to death – luckily they were able to revive her and save her with transfusions.
    My mother was not allowed to have an abortion (it was 1972 a year before Roe vs. Wade was passed), even though they new at three months that my sister would die. As a result, two children almost lost their mother, and my mother suffered a trauma that I don’t think she ever fully recovered from (she says it is the one thing in her past that still makes her cry).
    This is a moral OUTRAGE – my heart goes out to the poor young woman.

  16. Posted April 30, 2007 at 10:23 pm | Permalink

    Wow, Jessica. I have nothing but respect for your mother and absolute sadness and outrage that such an atrocity was allowed to happen to her. I can’t even imagine. I’m literally sitting here trying not to cry at the injustice of it.

  17. Posted April 30, 2007 at 10:39 pm | Permalink

    Thank you for your kind words, Cara.
    I have just spent some time looking at websites on the subject – something that I hadn’t done before. There were some very moving pictures of families with these babies, and I can understand why some mothers/couples feel the need to have the child in order to say goodbye.
    Unfortunately, my mother does not even have a picture of Aimee. At that time, 35 years ago, it wasn’t considered “a good idea” – which in my mind another injustice my mother had to suffer.
    I sincerely hope that if this young woman is FORCED to give birth to this poor baby, that she has the appropriate medical care during birth, and that she is allowed to grieve in the way that is right for her.

  18. Posted April 30, 2007 at 11:13 pm | Permalink

    Agreed. I’m constantly amazed at the way this world treats women and their ability to make decisions about their own lives.

  19. Frau Direktor
    Posted April 30, 2007 at 11:20 pm | Permalink

    GRRRRRR!!! Dinogirl–it’s a shame to see my country of heritage and your current home country is still so back-ass-wards on this.
    If you and other Irish women do something, please let us here know. I would like to support you. I’m supporting those trying to stop the M3 from slicing up the Hill of Tara. I most definitely want to support Irish women in this fight.

  20. Posted April 30, 2007 at 11:24 pm | Permalink

    Definitely. At the very least, someone has to get a petition or something going. If the politicians and mainstream organizations won’t do it, it’s time to go grassroots.

  21. cherylp
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 2:09 am | Permalink

    I am also outraged. Good for this young woman for standing up and fighting for what she deserves. I hope she has some supportive people close to her at this time (doesn’t sound like her mom or dad are around). Infuriating.

  22. Posted May 1, 2007 at 3:40 am | Permalink

    “And do you know how the politicians reacted? They brought a referendum proposing to END the suicide execption and make it illegal for pregnant women to leave the country to pursue an abortion (how they ever proposed enforcing this, I don’t know). That referendum was defeated, thankfully, because as I said before most Irish people ARE pro-choice. Our politicians are just wankers.”
    Very true. Also, that particular referendum was pushed and its terms were pretty much defined by Youth Defence, SPUC and the other anti-choice groups, not any of the mainstream parties, although of course they went along with it. As my mother always said, abortion should never have been in the constitution at all and indeed wasn’t until the early ’80s, when SPUC et al decided to push for an ammendment that clearly stated there would be no abortion in Ireland. That original referendum was passed (I am rather doubtful about the general pro-choice status of my fellow citizens as a result, although I think it’s more to do with the fact that we never have to face the true realities of being an abortion-free state thanks to the nearness of the UK, so they can just stick their heads in the sand. And of course things have changed a LOT in Ireland since 1981), albeit by a small margin. And that’s why it’s so hard to change the law here – it should be done through legislation, but once it was shoved into the constitution, it meant that any changes have to done through ammendments, which means referenda, which means another huge campaign by the anti-choice nutjobs. Sigh.
    Anyway, dinogirl and other Irish ladies, there is apparently going to be a rally in favour of the girl outside the GPO at 12 noon on Saturday. I’ll be there, although it’s a bit depressing that 15 years after my then 16-year-old self marched down O’Connell street with hundreds of others in support of the X Case girl and demanded a change in the law, it seems that nothing has really changed at all…

  23. FridayLeap
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 4:50 am | Permalink

    Dinogirl: I mailed the RTE link to Vanessa. I was so incensed that I wanted do *something* and at 9.30 at night that was the only thing I could think of. I mailed it to a couple of other US feminist blogs too but feministing were the only ones who picked it up. What are the Irish feminist blogs you mentioned? I was beginning to wonder if there were any other feminists in Ireland…
    See you at the rally?

  24. Silmarillion
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 5:40 am | Permalink

    It’s frustrating when the major parties in Ireland don’t want to touch the abortion issue. I’ve looked at the Labour website and they don’t propose any major changes in the short term, but in the long term they propose to “repeal of Articles 58 and 59 of the Offences Against the Person Act, 1861 and of Article 40.3.3 of the Irish Constitution.” Articles 58 and 59 state:

    58. Every woman, being with child, who, with intent to procure her own miscarriage, shall unlawfully administer to herself any poison or other noxious thing, or shall unlawfully use any instrument or other means whatsoever with the like intent, and whosoever, with intent to procure the miscarriage of any woman whether she be or be not with child, shall unlawfully administer to her or cause to be taken by her any poison or other noxious thing, or unlawfully use any instrument or other means whatsoever with the like intent, shall be guilty of felony, and being convicted thereof shall be liable … to be kept in penal servitude for life ….59. Whosoever shall unlawfully supply or procure any poison or other noxious thing, or any instrument or thing whatsoever, knowing that the same is intended to be unlawfully used or employed with intent to procure the miscarriage of any woman, whether she be or be not with child, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor, and being convicted thereof shall be liable … to be kept in penal servitude ….

    and Article 40.3.3 states:

    The State acknowledges the right to life of the unborn and, with due regard to the equal right to life of the mother, guarantees in its laws to respect, and, as far as practicable, by its laws to defend and vindicate that right.

    I couldn’t find much of interest on either the Fine Gael or Greens websites and the Fianna Fail website returned nothing at all.

  25. Posted May 1, 2007 at 6:03 am | Permalink

    I have just e-mailed most of the candidates in my constituency (now Dun Laoghaire, after spending most of my life in various parts of Dublin North Central) asking their position on the issue and making it clear that they won’t get my vote if they’re not pro-choice. At least we can let them know it’s an important issue, even if it’s unlikely to change their minds.

  26. Posted May 1, 2007 at 6:10 am | Permalink

    Also, FridayLeap, never fear, there are lots of other feminists in Ireland! A bunch of us organised a very successful Ladyfest Dublin two years ago. One of the nicest things was that while most of the attendees for the live shows and workshops were, unsurprisingly, in their twenties and thirties, lots of much older women turned up at the Hub in Eustace Street for the talk on “Radical Ladies in Irish History”.

  27. Posted May 1, 2007 at 7:10 am | Permalink

    The irish state has said it will not oppose the girl in the highcourt should she wish to travel for an abortion.
    This is a major step, we are still exporting our problem but at least this girl has some chance to decide her own outcome.

  28. Momo
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 8:14 am | Permalink

    Americans, behold our grim future.

  29. lauracw
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 8:41 am | Permalink

    Another annoyed Irish woman here – I can’t believe this is actually happening. Can you believe the appeal is not being held til Thursday?? I mean, time is of the essence here.
    It’s disgusting that none of the politicians give a damn. Let’s hear more about this rally and make THIS a talking point for the general election.
    Stellanova, I also doubt that the majority of our country is pro-choice: most people I’ve spoken to think the issue is about the abstract concept of when life beings, not the very messy reality of women who suffer unnecessary pain and misery if bringing a pregnancy to full term is the wrong thing to do.
    Laura

  30. Ranylt
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 9:01 am | Permalink

    I have been lurking for some time, and I expressly created an account this morning just so I could post.
    I’ve been wanting to pipe in about the fabulous quality and respectful tone of most comments on Feministing (so rare) and let staff know how much it’s appreciated; I also wanted this morning to add–thanks so much for providing news from abroad, not just the US. It makes us non-Americans feel we have a space here.
    A special thanks to the Irish contingent on this thread for filling me in on the current state of abortion rights in Ireland–I’ve been curious to hear “word from the street” on that for some time.

  31. Posted May 1, 2007 at 10:00 am | Permalink

    Stellanova, I also doubt that the majority of our country is pro-choice: most people I’ve spoken to think the issue is about the
    abstract concept of when life beings, not the very messy reality of women who suffer unnecessary pain and misery if bringing a pregnancy to full term is the wrong thing to do.

    Yes, that’s been my experience too. As I said above, I think this is because as a society we aren’t often forced to confront the realities of not having legal abortion because of the closeness of the UK, so people pretty much just pretend there isn’t a problem. When the X Case happened, lots of people were genuinely horrified at the thought of a rape victim being forced to give birth against her will, and the majority agreed she could travel. I know that many die-hard pro-life people simply (and rightly, of course) didn’t agree with restricting people’s movements, regardless of their intentions, but I’m slightly surprised that more of the general public didn’t think “well, why shouldn’t she be allowed to have the abortion here?” (I did, and the incident was basically what made me actively pro-choice as opposed to my previous vague teenage “oh well, abortion isn’t a good idea, but I feel sorry for people who are pregnant and don’t want to be” views.)
    Actually, that period seems to have been a consciousness-raising time on all sides. I was in fifth year at the time, and one of my classmates, who I’ll call D (because that’s her initial) joined Youth Defence; while the majority of the class became vaguely pro-choice, there were lots of heated debates between this girl and me and my best friend (we got called baby killers a lot). We stopped arguing with D once and for all when I came up with the most extreme test case I could think of and asked her if she thought a 12 year old pregnant incest victim should be allowed leave the country, whether she had publically stated her intention to get an abortion or not, and D said she shouldn’t be. I realised then there was no point in talking about it any more. Actually, there was a big story in Hot Press that year in which a reporter went undercover in YD and went to a party in D’s house. Two of my friends were at the party and were really annoyed because they were referred to in the piece as “new recruits”, which they definitely weren’t. I think Hot Press had to apologise for maligning their good names…

  32. katie
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 10:22 am | Permalink

    When i was studying in ireland 4 years ago i did my final paper in my feminist methodology class on this very issue. i agree that the woman should threaten suicide, its the only thing that worked in the X case and frankly i think its her only choice. however, we can only hope that this poor girls plight once again forces ireland to take a good look at their abortion policies. perhaps this will really make the people of ireland force their politicians. whoever said that its a good place to live generally as a woman is correct, but the catholic church has really done a number on both the irish people, and irish laws.

  33. Posted May 1, 2007 at 10:48 am | Permalink

    Breaking news from the Irish Times:
    State powerless to stop teen travelling to UK
    The State has no power to stop a teenage girl travelling to Britain for an abortion, the High Court was told today.
    The 17-year-old, who is four months pregnant, is challenging the Health Service Executive (HSE) which is preventing her from terminating her pregnancy overseas.
    The teenager, who can only be identified as Miss D and from the Leinster region, has been in the care of the HSE since March. She was told last week that her baby is suffering from the brain condition anencephaly, resulting in the absence of a major portion of the brain, skull and scalp.
    The newborn baby will live a maximum of three days.
    Mr Justice Liam McKechnie today granted the girl leave to bring a legal action to prevent the HSE restraining her leaving the country for an abortion.
    The case is being rushed through the courts system, and will be heard in full on Thursday morning.
    The girl maintains she was told by the HSE that it had contacted the gardai to request that she not be permitted to leave the State unless she was suicidal.
    However, the High Court heard the HSE and gardai had no power to stop the girl from travelling abroad.
    Donal O’Donnell SC, appearing for the Attorney General, said the HSE has no legal power to direct the gardai to restrain a person who is subject of an interim care order; that the gardai do not have the legal power to restrain someone simply because they are subject of an interim order; and that the HSE order does not restrain a person from travelling anywhere.
    The HSE said the teenager will undergo a psychiatrist examination later today, with a medical to be carried out on the girl and foetus if required.
    Gerard Hogan SC, representing Miss D, said in an affidavit his client said she was deeply distressed and could not live through the pregnancy knowing her baby would die, but stressed she was not suicidal.
    He said the girl had asked for the case to be heard in open court, as long as her identity was protected, adding it was of great importance that the case be heard as speedily as possible.
    “I ask for this case to be heard in a matter of days or at the very outset next Tuesday,” he said.
    Gerard Durkan SC, for the HSE, said his client was anxious for whatever course of action for the best welfare of the girl and would do that having regard for all the legal parameters and restraints that applied.
    Despite being in the care of the state, the girl’s mother appeared in the court to give the teenager her full backing. The woman — to be known as Miss A — agreed to apply for legal aid today so she can be legally represented during the case.
    Mr Justice McKechnie granted leave for a full hearing of the case on Thursday and ordered no details be reported which could identify the teenager. Miss A was ordered to appear before the judge tomorrow morning to ensure the application for legal aid was successful before the full hearing is called. If not the HSE offered to cover the cost of a solicitor for the woman.
    © 2007 ireland.com

    I think she’s very brave and I hope she and her partner get through this okay.

  34. String_Bean_Jen
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 11:29 am | Permalink

    Thanks for the news Stellanova! I, too, hope that this young woman and her mother (or partner) are able to safely travel to the UK to obtain the abortion she desires.
    Like katie, I did a research paper on Irish abortion law a couple years ago; in part inspired by a male Irish friend of mine who is possibly one of the most eloquent pro-choicers I’ve ever had the privilege of knowing. I also don’t think it’s a coincidence that he recently left Dublin for London!
    The Irish Family Planning Association is a pretty good resource whom I had contact with. They had sent me a heartbreaking collection of stories of women – young and old, rich and poor, majority and ethnic minority – who had shared their stories of travelling to the UK for abortions. The organization’s web site doesn’t seem to have much activism action, but have a look. I’m sure they are one of the most underfunded and understaffed family planning organizations in a western, first-world country. And yes (I think to Dinogirl), I believe Ireland is the only western, first-world country in which abortion is illegal.
    Ah, after a bit of searching, I see that the IFPA do have a few links to abortion activism.
    Good to hear from all you Irish feminists. We’re here with you in solidarity. xox

  35. paperdaisy
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 11:42 am | Permalink

    Edna O’Brien, an Irish author, wrote a novel called _Down By the River_ with a similar scenario to this one. When I read this headline I couldn’t believe it was actually happening in real life. I recommend that book highly, by the way.

  36. dinogirl
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 2:13 pm | Permalink

    I tried to put up a few links to the IFPA last night, but I don’t think to get through?
    Great to know that there are other Irish feminists out there! Will hopefully be at the march on Saturday, but I’m in the States on work at the mo, and it’s looking like I might not get back.
    BUT I can gladly provide some links to a few of my favourite Irish feminists!
    Sarah Carey is a feminist who also blogs on Irish politics in general
    http://www.sarahcarey.ie/
    Maman Poulet also writes great stuff on gay and disability rights
    http://www.mamanpoulet.com/
    The Sigla Blog
    http://www.sineadgleeson.com/blog/
    And fatmammycat is so far the only one to have a post on this
    http://fatmammycat.blogspot.com/
    There are loads more – these ladies link to them.
    I’m glued to RTE’s RSS feed. Really, really hope this young woman is going to be allowed to leave.

  37. FEMily!
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 3:54 pm | Permalink

    That’s crazy. The fetus wouldn’t even be viable anyway. Why do the imagined rights of a fetus that will not and cannot even survive take precedence over the actual human rights of a woman?

  38. Mina
    Posted May 1, 2007 at 7:08 pm | Permalink

    “Stellanova, I also doubt that the majority of our country is pro-choice: most people I’ve spoken to think the issue is about the abstract concept of when life beings, not the very messy reality of women who suffer unnecessary pain and misery if bringing a pregnancy to full term is the wrong thing to do.”
    On another forum I saw someone who claims to be an Irish man insist that it’s unreasonable to take the woman’s or girl’s feelings into account…and insist that the Irish weren’t sexually active until the 1970s. o_O

  39. pennyrua
    Posted May 3, 2007 at 3:38 am | Permalink

    Just thought I would add to the discussion an update: it seems the unborn fetus has been given legal representation. Not sure if I can link on comments so you can find it on the Irish Times website. I have been on this site a few times but I (like another poster earlier) had to sign up to an account and comment on this issue. It is absolutely shocking that this is happening-the whole drama now seems like something out of a surreal dream/nightmare. I will be at the GPO on Saturday to protest with other Irish feminists and I just have to say how ashamed I am that my country is making this poor girl suffer.

  40. pennyrua
    Posted May 3, 2007 at 3:40 am | Permalink

    Just thought I would add to the discussion an update: it seems the unborn fetus has been given legal representation. Not sure if I can link on comments so you can find it on the Irish Times website. I have been on this site a few times but I (like another poster earlier) had to sign up to an account and comment on this issue. It is absolutely shocking that this is happening-the whole drama now seems like something out of a surreal dream/nightmare. I will be at the GPO on Saturday to protest with other Irish feminists and I just have to say how ashamed I am that my country is making this poor girl suffer.

  41. pennyrua
    Posted May 3, 2007 at 3:42 am | Permalink

    Just thought I would add to the discussion an update: it seems the unborn fetus has been given legal representation. Not sure if I can link on comments so you can find it on the Irish Times website.http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2007/0502/breaking41.htm I have been on this site a few times but I (like another poster earlier) had to sign up to an account and comment on this issue. It is absolutely shocking that this is happening-the whole drama now seems like something out of a surreal dream/nightmare. I will be at the GPO on Saturday to protest with other Irish feminists and I just have to say how ashamed I am that my country is making this poor girl suffer.

  42. EG
    Posted May 3, 2007 at 10:36 am | Permalink

    it seems the unborn fetus has been given legal representation.
    Oh for pete’s sake. Does that mean that the pregnant woman can sue it for assault?

  43. Posted May 9, 2007 at 8:15 am | Permalink

    A decision from the courts is expected at 2pm today.
    There’s an Irish based pro-choice blog that has been following the case here:

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